
I have said it before. Redfin’s success, and the success of the countless other Refin-ish companies out there, will be their failure.
The “who pays the commission” debate rages on over at the Bloodhound, as does the banter about divorcing the seller’s agent and buyer’s agent commissions. I won’t attempt to tackle the “who pays” subject this morning, at least not in a big way. I have gone on record many times as saying the seller pays. That is the reality. The seller establishes the total commission and the seller establishes the amount of the coop to the buyer’s agent.
The bigger issue I see is the issue of whose money the buyer-side commission is versus the perception of whose money it is. And it is this perception that what will drive us toward divorcing the buy- and sell-side agent paychecks.
I have already been received a mini brow beating this week for my unpopular comments on the role agents play in making a market, so I am on a roll. I might as well stoke the fire - If I am representing the buyer, the coop fee is my money. Period. And, what I choose to do with this money is my decision. If I am Redfin, I will choose to give 2/3rds of it to my client, if I am Buyside Realty, I will choose to give more. Most “traditional” agents will confess that there are many times they will choose to credit their client some amount due to repeat business, to close the gap at the contract negotiation stage, or even to resolve repair issues arising from the property inspection.
But, regardless of who pays, it is the agent’s money, at least at close of escrow, for services rendered. Russell Shaw said as much in this recent post (read between the lines), so maybe he will come to my defense when the friendly fire ensues. It is the agent’s money, and everyone wants a piece of it.
- Agent as Principal. This one is easy, and we get a lot of these. They can and will represent themselves. ”I live in (a land far, far away), and I am a licensed agent. I saw your listing on (pick your favorite search engine site). Can you let me in to see the home? And, oh, by the way, how much is the buyer’s agent commission?” Aside from the added hassle to the listing agent of having to provide access to the property and the fact that the out-of-area agent lacks the knowledge of the market, local disclosures, area practices and contracts, the Agent as Principal considers himself in a position to perform on his own behalf, and he will be “compensated” for those services to himself.
- Listing Agent Shopper. “I do not have an agent. If I let you represent me, how much will you give me?” Never do they say, “My commission is “x”. How much will I have to pay you?” In any event, it is the listing agent as potential buyer’s agent who has the choice to share his paycheck for buy-side services rendered, or not.
- Limited-Services Broker Client. “I do not have an agent. Can you show me the home?” Wait, this is the wrong topic. Okay, too many times the clients of the limited services model tend to initially lie to gain access, knowing that they are asking you to do the job for which their agent is going to be paid, and their agent has chosen to give them some portion of their commission. Most of us agree that the limited services agent will not truly, fully earn the commission, but their commission it is.
And then, there are the traditional agents who make the introduction and perform the traditional broker duties for and on the behalf of their clients. This is their job, one for which they will be paid. Some of these agents may choose to credit a portion of their paycheck to their clients in proportion to value they place on themselves, and sadly, too many seem to place very little value in their abilities, but it is their choice.
These traditional agents are the agents that are still involved in the majority of our transactions, but their numbers are diminishing. And here is why. All of the other folks I spoke of will accept a lower level of service because they perceive little risk in lesser representation. They expect, rightly so, that the listing agent will pick up the slack to ensure a successful transaction. The listing agent is increasingly being put in the position of accepting more work, more responsibility and more liability so that the buyer’s agent can give justify a business model centered on giving their own paycheck away. And the buyer’s agent is leaving the buyer with the perception that their money is somehow not really their own.
So, why may commissions ultimately be divorced and why might we just live to see a world in which the seller pays their agent and the buyer pays their own? Because each time a Redfin or the like climbs the popularity ladder, because with the success of each new listing agent shopper and discount seeker, one more nail is being driven into the coffin of the traditional buyer’s agent. When we have a world of people seeking money for nothing and a world of agents willing to deliver, the seller will have no reason to offer a coop.
Which brings me back to the wisdom of divorcing commissions and the future of the opportunists who aspire to feed on the buyer coop carrion. No coop means that buyers will finally be asked assign a value to the their representation. Buyer’s agents will finally have to demonstrate their value and earn their fee. And when the agents representing the buyers have nothing to give away but conversely have to place a price on their services and actually charge their clients directly, the associated accountability will only benefit the buyer… and the Redfins of this world will no longer have a shtick.








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Jim Duncan
07.16.07 at 10:29 am
Well said, Kris. Very well said.
Jeff Brown
07.16.07 at 11:37 am
Kris - This discussion interests me on two levels.
First, since I go back to the days when some of my buddies found themselves frozen forever in the La Brea tar pits, the way brokerages treated buyers’ agents back then could be of interest.
I worked for Dad, who had the biggest volume house brokerage in San Diego county in the mid-late ’60’s. Listing agents received 20% commission on the listing side, while the buyer’s agent received 40% of the buyer’s side - twice as much. Why? My dad’s thinking was that though listing a property was paramount to the business, there was no income until there was an actual sale made - and closed.
I agree.
Second, 2/3 of the time we’re either in a ‘normal’ market or a down market, not an on-fire, rising market. I’m not arguing against the business model that says ‘the lister is king’ because I paradoxically believe that to be true. However, when almost 70% of the time solid skills and professional expertise are required to put a property in escrow, the buyer’s agent should get at least what the listing agent does.
And bless your cold banker’s heart for telling the truth - the buyer’s side commission is yours - period.
Whenever a buyer tries to edge in on one of my well earned dollars, I give them two choices and a minute to choose. Either find another agent, or never bring it up again. There’s no such thing as a free lunch, and I’m not your mom.
Finally, buyers of homes, as opposed to investments, know their market pretty well, at least most of the time. No matter what any agent says, a huge difference in sales prices just won’t be happening in most markets - from agent to agent. The key, as you said, is in the total package of skills, expertise, and experience offered by the agent.
You and Steve have nothing to worry about, as if it ever really happens, (divorced commission) you guys will be taking other agents’ clients right and left - at least the ones looking for quality representation.
Kris Berg
07.16.07 at 11:53 am
Jeff- I hereby concede my rubber chicken. You are so, so funny even when you are trying to be serious. Great points, all of them.
Chris Lengquist
07.16.07 at 12:54 pm
Pilots are also useless. You don’t need them except for the three minutes the plane is taking off and the three minutes the plane is landing. Oh, and when the engine quits at 37,000 feet.
Steve Berg
07.16.07 at 3:18 pm
Jeff and Kris - Two great commentaries. Very impressive. But I remain in the dinosaurs camp. The commission divorce will not occur any time soon. I’m not saying you’re wrong. I just think the buyers aren’t going to let their pockets get picked and that’s the perception they will have.
Phil Hoover
07.16.07 at 9:35 pm
This whole debate is pretty much a moot point when we have buyers who appreciate competent, responsive service.
I rarely get into situations where a respectful, appreciative client thinks I do not deserve a fair fee.
It’s the disrespectful, unrealistic, demanding clients who want me to give up some of my fee.
And, they’re always the ones who want more service than the good clients do.
And, I’m sure they would be the first ones to sqeal if they were asked to pay a buyer agent from their own funds, despite the fact that they really ARE paying their buyer agent as part of the purchase price.
Most clients don’t want to THINK about commissions or agency representation, they just want the home they want and good service.
Agents and attorneys are the ones who are concerned about this stuff.
Jeff Brown
07.16.07 at 10:49 pm
Steve - I absolutely DON’T think commissions will ever be ‘divorced’.
This entire discussion is much ado about not much. The idea is essentially about whether we should say six or half a dozen. Russ has it right.
Phil’s got it right too - the only buyers whining about our commissions (and these are my words, not Phil’s, as he’s too nice) are the ones who want something for nothing.
As soon as agents stop wringing their hands in serious discussion of this wholly worthless idea, it will die a natural death - as it has every time it’s come up since Tricky Dick was president.
Jeff Brown
07.16.07 at 11:29 pm
Kris - thanks. Making you laugh makes my day.
Thomas Heimann
07.17.07 at 3:37 am
Actually, if you want to be factually and legally accurate, then the co-op commission does *not* belong to the agent, but to the broker. Which part, if any, belongs to the agent is determined by the compensation agreement between the agent and the broker.
Phil Hoover
07.17.07 at 9:24 am
Jeff ~
I was just tryin to be a lil tactful
Russell Shaw
07.22.07 at 1:47 pm
Kris,
I agree (pretty much with everything you ever say).
Kris Berg
07.22.07 at 5:49 pm
And that, Mr. Shaw, is why I love you!
Dale Rainey
07.23.07 at 6:40 pm
I’m probably jumping into hot water here by entering the discussion, but I’ll throw in my 2 cents worth. I am one of the limited service companies http://www.ulistit.com. My opinion is that commissions will at some point cease to be based on a percentage model. It seems to make more sense (except if you are on the receiving end of a large commission) that real estate services are charged similar to other professions like accountants and attorneys which “generally” charge by the hour. An agent would then based on his professionalism and experience be able to garner more per hour than an entry level agent does.
What sense does it make now that an agent makes the same, be it 2%,3% or whatever irregardless of the level of service he provides as long as the deal closes. I see so many agents in our transactions that do not do their job, yet get paid the same as the goods ones.
In the end capitalism will win, those that provide the service will be able to garner the higher fees, regardless of whatever fee structure we end up with.
Cheers
kc
07.23.07 at 9:41 pm
Better watch out Dale, most of the Realtors here will call you a “discount broker”, with no skills offering clients subpar service. Hope you serve your clients well but some agents will boycott working with “discount brokers”. How can you offer any service comparable to the “full service” agents? Where is my 6%!! Its mine! Good luck, but you should do a search here on Redfin. I have read posts from Realtors who call colleagues in the limited services field as “ilk” and so on. Hard to have a business relationship with people who do not respect you. I do hope that the client is better served in the end. That is what it is all about……….
Kris Berg
07.27.07 at 7:55 am
Thomas - Just saved you from the depths of my spam catcher. Sorry.
You are absolutely correct in that the commission is the broker’s. Appreciate the clarification.
Until it happens...
04.02.08 at 7:32 am
Unless and until dual agency becomes a thing of the past, the buyer broker commission will always be a cause for conflict of interest. Ask any true professional who is paid on fee like an attorney or an accountant.
Cash Back Realtor Buyer's Agent Rebate - Testimonials Atlanta, GA Georgia
06.04.08 at 10:40 am
Common sense would suggest that a home buyer is free to shop around without a buyer’s agent. Furthermore, the buyer may not understand about buyer agency until further research — which may be after visiting new home communities. Should the buyer be denied representation because he/she did not enlist a buyer’s agent from the beginning? Absolutely not.
The buyer bears some of the burden for real estate commissions through the price of the house; hence, the buyer should be able to select whomever he/she wishes prior to signing a purchase & sale agreement. While listing agents and/or home builders might contend differently, look at what the USDOJ has to say on the matter:
“Although the seller pays this commission, the buyer bears part of the burden of the commission through the sales price of the home.”